RE: No death before the fall theology

From: Debbie Mann (deborahjmann@insightbb.com)
Date: Sat Apr 26 2003 - 13:37:58 EDT

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    All or nothing?
    Either the scribes of the Bible sat like spiritualists at a seance and wrote
    everything down in the exact verbage of God or it has nothing to do with
    God?
    Either it has been preserved verbatim for 6000 years or it should be thrown
    in the trash? Not even worthy of display in a museum?
    If our copies have transcriptional errors from 600BCE, then we should
    discount the whole things as being devoid of truth?

    Am I to assume that pre-writing people were given spiritual material which
    could survive memorization by generations of oral historians, retranslation
    by a variety of cultures - many of them writing by candle light using a
    variety of primitive pens and inks, social evolution that took man from
    caves and huts and firelight to computers - and yet the literature is
    supposed to be translatable into all cultures in all times with exactly the
    same divine meaning?

    And if I do not accept this literal belief the only alternative is to accept
    that the Bible is "WRONG"?

    By that standard, I should throw out every textbook with a typo. 'Hey,
    professor, I didn't study for the test because the textbook is wrong.'

    I used to be a mathematician, now I'm an engineer. Do you want to know the
    difference? There's a frog jumping half the distance to the finish line each
    time he jumps. Does he ever get to the finish line? The mathematician says
    no. The engineer says, "If I'm a fly, I'm going to get out of there."

    I don't trade in my car when it gets a ding, I don't buy a new sofa at the
    first stain on the old, I don't put my kid up for adoption when she splashes
    paint on my new drapes.

    I'm not going to devalue the greatest book of all time because Man, unholy,
    unperfect, man, has tainted the Holy Book with His Humanity.

    There are a number of books available from both camps on the Bible. One of
    the 'against' resorted to attacks on semantics. One of the 'fors' provides a
    great quantity of circumstantial evidence, cultural consistencies in odd
    details. There is also direct architectural evidence for a large portion of
    the book.

    When I was in school, 96% was often an A and 38% was occasionally a passing
    grade. Yet, attackers of The Bible seem to believe that if they can find one
    fault, or show that 5% is inconclusive, vague or impossible to take
    literally - that the portion that has been verified by multiple sources can
    be ignored and the portion which is unverified is definitely wrong.

    By this standard, I and everyone I know would have been tossed on the trash
    heap long ago.

    -----Original Message-----
    From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu]On
    Behalf Of Jim Eisele
    Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 11:25 AM
    To: asa@calvin.edu
    Subject: Re: No death before the fall theology

    Um, I don't see anyone addressing the point here.
    Maybe you need an atheist for some objectivity.

    YECs know what the Bible says. Then they become
    a cult as they retreat from modernity and impose
    irrationality/ignorance on their followers.

    Those not interested in truth-seeking should
    probably stop reading NOW.

    Your Bible is wrong. It is a mythological
    explanation for death, a la Pandora's box.

    The Bible says Adam is the first man about
    6,000 years ago, and the rest is in the book.

    TE/OEC won't reconcile with the Bible, despite
    the pained twistings of Christians.

    Now, I appreciate non-YEC Christians for their
    efforts to keep that ignorance in check.

    But the Bible can't be defended once you give
    up YEC. Tough choice.

    Jim Eisele

    P.S.
    I debated whether or not to post this to a
    Christian list. It is the disturbing lack of
    honesty and integrity that I have seen among
    some Christians that prompted me to do so.



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