Re: (non-flame post) good chess programs intelligent?

From: DNAunion@aol.com
Date: Mon Oct 16 2000 - 01:11:19 EDT

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    >DNAunion: … So, after all this, what are others' views on whether a chess
    computer possesses some form of intelligence? Have human intelligent agents
    already created a new form of intelligence that is not biological?

    >Brian: Being an avid chess player I cannot resist answering this one :).
    The short answer is that chess playing computer programs are not intelligent.
     I'm not sure whether a program would pass the Turing test you outlined. I
    have a feeling it would not given that a strong player (grandmaster) familiar
    with how computers play were the one checking.

    DNAunion: Surely 10 years ago even most average chess players could tell the
    difference. In fact, companies advertising chess computers made a point of
    emphasizing how much more "human-like" theirs played. Back then, for
    example, one could confound most chess programs by simply opening 1. a3, 1.
    e3, or 1. d3. Even though these are considered weak opening moves and a
    human playing black would equalize, at least, quickly and easily, when the
    same moves were played against a computer, they practically guaranteed an
    opening advantage. This is no longer true as computers have been programmed
    with hundreds of thousands of opening moves, and even when you get them out
    of their stored book lines, they still have a much better "understanding" of
    the goals of the opening and handle it more "intelligently". Also in the
    past, computer programs were masters of tactics, but were terrible at
    positional play. Just lock up the position and watch the opponent flounder:
    that could be a strong indicator that you were playing a computer. But this
    too has changed drastically: closed positions are no longer lethal weapons
    against the better chess programs, and in fact, chess programs have pulled
    off brilliant *positional* sacrifices in many of their tournament games.
    With their strong positional games, the elimination of holes in opening
    books, the strengthening of their opening strategy, and much better play in
    the endgame, today's chess computers play very human like: I am not sure that
    even grandmasters could tell the difference accurately when not viewing 100
    different opponents, 50 of which were advanced chess computers and 50 of
    which were international grandmasters.
     
    >Brian: But since this is not clear, let me give another experiment more in
    the spirit of a Turing test. Here a knowledgeable chess player gets to ask
    "questions" where the questions are board positions with instructions like
    "white to move, what's the best move?". The positions are carefully selected
    so that they are highly tactical and intricate but lead to a forced win for
    white after 8 or 10 moves. Give a sequence of these positions and then
    conclude that the computer is the one with the best score.

    DNAunion: I feel confident that great human tacticians - either
    international grandmasters known for their tactical prowess, or players who
    compose chess puzzles - would score very high under these conditions. Are
    you sure this would accurately distinguish between computers and humans? For
    example, humans often times have an "intuition" about what move is the best,
    even before doing any explicit mental calculations (Bobby Fischer was said to
    have great "sight of board", meaning that he could walk up to a position
    without any prior knowledge of it and pick the best move intuitively in a
    heartbeat): especially when they know the position is a problem (they see a
    loose piece, or a weakened king position, or one side having better control
    of the center or more pieces positioned in proximity to the opponent's king,
    etc.). If you hand some tactical chess puzzles to a master tactician, he or
    she will probably see the correct move within the first couple seconds, and
    would need more time only to analyze the position to make sure that the move
    he or she mentally flagged as the best candidate is in fact the best (if not,
    then candidate number 2 would be analyzed). But I don't think an
    international grandmaster known for tactics or a chess puzzle composer would
    score worse than a computer on these kinds of positions.

    >Brian: Oh, to make it clearer you have a time limit of 5 or 10 minutes per
    position.

    DNAunion: As I said above, I believe the best humans would be able to pick
    out the best move within that time frame. In fact, a few years ago there was
    a foreign player that typically spent only 30 minutes or so - in total: for
    the entire game - in his games and matches against other international
    grandmasters (who themselves spent several hours); and he was a contender for
    the world championship and did not deviate from his breakneck pace even in
    those matches (sorry, when I got out of chess, I sold all my FIDE Informants
    and no longer have access to the player's name). I imagine he - and others -
    might be misclassified as a computer under your test conditions.

    >Brian: To make it even easier, have the first 3 or 4 moves of the winning
    variation be very "odd" (untypical) moves.

    DNAunion: You mean like sacrificing a queen or the exchange? If so, this
    would not throw the best human players - espcially those that compose chess
    puzzles themselves. Perhaps you meant some kind of a tempo move - a waiting
    move where any move the opponent makes worsens his/her position, with that
    waiting move also setting up the win. Again, these are typical in chess
    puzzles and most humans that are good at solving such positions might be
    classified as computers under your test conditions.

    >Brian: Several years ago one the older grandmasters (I want tosay Robert
    Byrne) dug up one the old masterpieces
    played by Morphy or Alekhine or someone similar. There was a truly brilliant
    combination in this game which the author claimed a computer would never
    find. Next month he had to eat his words since many readers wrote to him
    telling him that their programs found the winning move in just a few seconds.
     This shows that the author really didn't appreciate how it is that computers
    play so well. But, if we do understand this, we can easily construct a Turing
    test that will find the computer.

    DNAunion: I still disagree (but not emphatically). I believe that IGMs who
    are master tacticians - or players who compose chess puzzles themselves -
    would be misclassified under your test conditions.

    SIDE COMMENT. By the way, several years ago my chess friend and I composed a
    forced mate in 16 that no computer we have tried has so far solved: that
    includes my Fritz-engine-based computer program running on its highest level
    for 2 days on a dedicated 300 MHz Pentium II system with 128 MB RAM. Here is
    the position, white to move and mate in 16:

    White: King on h2, Queen on c4, Rooks on c8 & f7, Bishop on c2, Knight on
    d6, Pawns on e4, g2, & h4

    Black: King on g6, Queen on a1, Rooks on a8 & g4, Bishop on f6, Knights on e5
    & g8, Pawns on g7 & h5.

    I think this shows that chess computers are not as "all-powerful" tactically
    as some might believe.
     
    >Brian: I think the problem with your argument is that it is an argument by
    analogy and these types of arguments are notoriously weak. The argument
    seems to go basically like this. (1) Humans play chess well because they are
    intelligent. (2) Therefore it requires intelligence to play chess well. (3)
    Computers play chess well. (4) Therefore computers are intelligent. The flaw
    is with statement (2). The problem is that when computers are playing chess
    they are not doing anything remotely similar to what a human is doing. They
    play chess well for the same reason that they perform finite element
    simulations well. They are very fast.

    DNAunion: I disagree to some degree. Computers do not simply examine all
    possible moves over many plies and then pick the one with the greatest
    mathematical increase in "piece score" - that leads to very limited tactical
    abilities as the number of moves that must be examined increases
    exponentially while time does not. For example, assuming 30 legal moves per
    player per position, consider the following. A *very simple*
    white-to-move-and-win-a-piece-on-his-3rd-move tactic would require looking at
    30^5, or over 24 million, positions. That's fine so far. But for a *modest*
    combination where white wins a piece on his 5th move, the number of positions
    that need to be analyzed jumps to 30^9, or almost 20 trillion, positions.
    Moving on to a lengthier combination where white wins a piece on his 7th
    move, the number skyrockets to 30^13, or over 15 quintillion - that is, 15
    million trillion - positions! Even the fastest computers cannot handle
    examining that many positions under tournament time limits (or even years!).
    They must invoke something other than pure brute force to find such winning
    moves (and they do: intelligently-programmed selection algorithms that prune
    sequence branches). Or consider positions in which neither side can force
    the win of material after 5 full moves. What does the computer do? There is
    no mathematical advantage to one ending position over all the others, so does
    it just find all those millions of possible ending positions that share the
    top mathematical spot, pick one of them at random, and then play the move the
    began that series? No. Computers evaluate the resulting leaf positions
    based on standard considerations: control of the center, mobility, potential
    threats, king safety, pawn formations, etc., just as humans do, and then
    select the root (first ply) move that lead to it. Computers evaluate
    positions to save on processing: if a computer runs across a position in
    which material is equal at that time, but its pawn position has been
    compromised, its king has been exposed, its knight is on the rim, its only
    bishop is sealed in by its own pawns, it has opened up the position by
    exchanging pawns in the center even though the opponent is better developed,
    etc., it will judge that position as inferior to others that do not share
    these negative attributes, even though the piece score could be the same.
    This borders on some form of intelligence: some form of thought process
    (whether the computer possesses it itself, or is merely a stand-in for the
    programmers is a different issue).

    >Brian: Consider for example that deeper blue can analyze about 200 million
    positions per second.
     
    DNAunion: Yes, but as I pointed out above, even at that rate, Deep Blue
    would be unable to solve a combination leading to the win of a piece on its
    7th move if it used simple "piece sums" in evaluating positions. At 2 x 10^8
    (200 million) positions per second, and approximately 1.5 x 10^19 (15
    quintillion) positions to examine, that would require 7.5 x 10^10 seconds, or
    over 2,000 years!

    >Brian: How could any human possibly survive even 20 moves against such a
    monster? The reason is that humans are very intelligent while the computer is
    merely fast :).

    DNAunion: But computers are not "merely fast" - they must also "know" what
    they are doing: they must still have some form of "intelligence" - involved
    algorithms that do far more than simply sum up the values of remaining pieces
    - to find the best move - no matter how fast they operate (it does not matter
    how fast you can run, if you run in a circle, you will get nowhere). They
    still must understand about a minority attack, the standard attacks when
    opposite-side castling occurs, attacks against a fianchettoed bishop, value
    of passed pawns and of protected passed pawns, advantages of knights over
    bishops, advantages of bishops over knights, how the relative values of
    bishops and knights change as the position opens up or closes or as endgame
    approaches, that the king should be tucked away during the opening and
    middlegame, but should become active and centralized during the endgame,
    about the concept of blockade, etc. The output of such chess programs, if
    not intelligent, at the least mimics the intelligent output produced by
    humans.



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