From: Debbie Mann (deborahjmann@insightbb.com)
Date: Tue Apr 29 2003 - 19:40:03 EDT
You're still making broad statements. And you keep going back to the same
single point without directly answering any of the questions we answer. So
maybe we didn't pay close enough attention to your verse.
The verse is Genesis 3:19.
1.Let's assume, for the sake of argument, that that one verse is blatantly
false.
Why would that negate the rest of Genesis, let alone the whole Bible?
2.Let's consider the way we would say it today. I think it would end, for
molecules you were and to molecules you shall return. A little obscure for
the times, don't you think?
And personally, I believe that that is exactly the point.
Allegorically, or literally- whichever - God is saying, "Man, you aren't
great like I am. I was going to do everything for you, but since you
couldn't accept my gift, you get to work hard and then have your body
decay - while I am infinite. You should have picked your friends better."
-----Original Message-----
From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu [mailto:asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu]On
Behalf Of Jim Eisele
Sent: Tuesday, April 29, 2003 5:40 PM
To: RFaussette@aol.com
Cc: asa@calvin.edu
Subject: Re: The Nature of Atheist - Christian dialogue
Rich writes
>>Before coming to this list I made my bones at hbe-l, a list populated by
scientists, most of whom were atheists. They had no patience with
metaphysics at all. When there was a position, it was defended, with
references that could be checked. Opinions were not respected without some
basis in fact. For you to say, I am an atheist, and you Christians just
don't get it and to say it over and over and over again without responding
with a principled argument and presumptously repeating the same mantra of
you Christians don't get it is not constructive. It's not science and it's
not religion. Nor do you respond to objections. I don't understand what
you are doing here unless it is simply to boldly trash the religion. What is
it you are gaining with this pattern of behavior? You have an agenda, not a
defense.
I thought pontificating was what Catholics did?
I've asked if you are a converso, which would make your behavior
intelligible, but you do not respond. Are other religions besides
Christianity offensive to atheists? Is Judaism offensive to atheists? Or are
you just deconstructing Christianity?>>
In an ideal world, people would have all the information
they needed, and the "decision" about Christianity would
be a no-brainer.
My goal isn't to shove atheism down anyone's throats.
Generally speaking, this list does a good job of getting
information on the table and letting people make up their
own minds.
Let's stick to the issue. Gen 3:19 is compelling evidence
that Genesis is mythology. This is obviously a touchy
topic. I spoke up because I perceived the important
aspects of this discussion were being ignored. Sorry if I
got on anyone's nerves. The flow of the discussion
led into other areas that I felt were necessary to
bring up. To be perfectly honest, I don't think this
list is ready for serious atheist - Christian dialogue.
Gen 3:19 is so clearly and obviously talking about physical
death, though, it really gets on my nerves when Christians
dishonestly pretend otherwise.
Jim
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