Re: choice as part of the design

From: Stephen E. Jones (sejones@iinet.net.au)
Date: Tue Nov 07 2000 - 22:21:22 EST

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    Reflectorites

    On Thu, 02 Nov 2000 22:28:23 -0600, Chris Cogan wrote:

    [...]

    CC>Jones has even gone
    >so far (following similar claims by Johnson) as to claim that ultimate
    >starting points must be simply assumed, ...

    Indeed! If Chris disagrees how does he propose to arrive at an *ultimate*
    starting point except by, in the end, assuming it?

    Since reason works from premises to conclusions where does Chris get his
    ultimate premise from? If he bases it on another reason then that must rest
    on a yet more ultimate premise, unless he starts to reason in a circle.

    This is not to say that one's ultimate premise cannot be critiqued - it can
    and be replaced by another ultimate premise. To that extent Chris is
    misconstruing what Johnson (and I) are saying by prefacing "assumed"
    with "simply". The process at arriving at an ultimate premise does not have
    to be simple, but in the end an ultimate premise must indeed be assumed.

    An *ultimate* premise cannot, by definition, be supported by any reasons
    more ultimate than itself:

            "By not asking the last question, Leff in effect placed the death of
            God, in the place of God. In his system, the absence of a
            supernatural evaluator was a premise so far beyond question that it
            could not be doubted even when it pointed to a conclusion. Leff
            desperately wanted to escape, even a conclusion he acknowledged
            to be false. If we know that totalitarian mass murder is evil, and
            that those who acquiesced in it deserved damnation, then we know
            something about the absolute evaluator as well. Leff offered no
            reason for protecting modernism's founding premise from the
            brilliant sceptical analysis that he directed at everything else. To a
            theist this must seem indefensible, but Leff could not have done
            otherwise without ceasing to be a modernist. A system's ultimate
            premise is always beyond question; that is what it means to say that
            is an ultimate premise. The most interesting aspect of any argument
            is not what it explicitly states, but what it implicitly assumes. A
            rationalistic culture teaches us to think that truth is the product of a
            process of logical reasoning. When we are dealing with
            intermediate or detailed truths, this model is correct. The model
            breaks down, however, when we try to apply it to the fundamental
            premises themselves. This is because logic is a way of getting to
            conclusions from premises. By its very nature, a logical argument
            cannot justify the premises upon which it rests. When these
            premises are questioned, they have to be justified by a different
            logical argument, which rests upon different premises. We may
            follow this process forever, and we will still never encounter
            anything but another logical argument, which will itself be based
            upon premises. But then what is the ultimate premises, the
            Archimedean fulcrum on which intellect can sit and judge all the
            rest? If we try to answer that question by employing logic we lapse
            into the absurdity of circular reasoning. Reasoning has to start
            somewhere. Any attempt to justify the ultimate starting point
            necessarily fails. Because it only establishes a different starting
            point. Hence, the really important step in any argument is apt to be
            the unexplained, unjustified, and often unstated starting point."
            (Johnson P.E., "Nihilism and the End of Law", First Things, March
            993, No. 31. http://id-www.ucsb.edu/fscf/LIBRARY/JOHNSON/nihilism.html)

    Chris no doubt dislikes this simple truth because he seems to fancy himself
    as something of a rationalist. But *pure* rationalism is a delusion. In the
    end one must chose one's ultimate premises by *faith* based on the best
    available, but necessarily limited, evidence. And of course one is strongly
    biased by what one *wants* to be true (see tagline).

    And of course if one is wrong in one's choice of ultimate premise then all
    one's conclusions based on that premise are wrong too. For example,
    if Chris' ultimate premise is (say) that there is no God, and there is, then all
    his reasons about evolution and Christianity are, to that extent, wrong (and
    of course vice-versa).

    This is the *real* reason for the intractable differences in philosophies among
    humans. It is not that those one disagrees with are "irrational" (as Richard
    naively imagines) but that we are all rational and have *chosen* different
    ultimate starting points.

    We can of course debate these ultimate starting points and indeed
    we do. But what *is* irrational is to deny that such ultimate starting points
    must necessarily exist and/or that they have to be, at the end of the
    day, *assumed*.

    [...]

    Steve

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------
    "Multiple hypotheses should be proposed whenever possible. Proposing
    alternative explanations that can answer a question is good science. If we
    operate with a single hypothesis, especially one we favor, we may direct
    our investigation toward a hunt for evidence in support of this hypothesis."
    (Campbell N.A., Reece J.B. & Mitchell L.G., "Biology," [1987],
    Benjamin/Cummings: Menlo Park CA, Fifth Edition, 1999, p.14)
    Stephen E. Jones | Ph. +61 8 9448 7439 | http://www.iinet.net.au/~sejones
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------



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