RE: I've also read Spetner's book

Pim van Meurs (entheta@eskimo.com)
Fri, 17 Sep 1999 09:11:19 -0700

Bertvan: I agree that something other than chance is behind the universe.

Based on what evidence? Or is this just a hunch?

Bertvan: I just think God set up the system where he chance would lead to the result he
wanted. If I shoot craps with you and use a loaded set of dice, I am
using chance to obtain the result I want, namely taking your money. Chance
does not require mindlessness behind it.

Nor does the presence of 'intelligence' mean that chance cannot be used to 'create'.

Bertvan: Similarly, that is what I think God did when he set up the biological
system. He rigged the odds so that when mutations occured they would still
lead to us.

I am looking forward to some evidence supporting this. IMHO this is an ultimate example of human 'hubris' in that man believes that he is unique and specially 'designed'.

Bertvan: This is a union of chance and determinism.

Wow, just like evolution.

Bertvan: One can see this in
the marvelous nonlinear equations like Duffy's equation, the Henon-Heiles
potential, quantum mechanical wave functions etc.

So 'chance' (non linear equations) can produce something that might appear otherwise. I guess you have a big problem here to distinguish the two.

Bertvan: Each of those use chance but the outcome is deterministic! God can use the mathematical laws that he set up to create us--using chance but with the outcome entirely
deterministic.

Just like evolution.