From: Debbie Mann (deborahjmann@insightbb.com)
Date: Sun Apr 27 2003 - 10:12:34 EDT
Okay, I'm convinced
that you are angry at someone or something that you associate with the
Bible. I gave you good, solid rebuttal and you ignored it. You make claims
that you apparently can't substantiate.
I have far better things to do with my time than have an illogical,
uneducated debate with someone who is just angry, ornery or both.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Eisele [mailto:jeisele@starpower.net]
Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2003 8:54 AM
To: Debbie Mann
Cc: asa@calvin.edu
Subject: Re: No death before the fall theology
Debbie writes
<snip to stay on point>
>Believe it or not. I was raised in church forever. I taught Vacation bible
>School as a teenager and as an adult, have taught Sunday School, taken many
>seminars, buy many sermon tapes, take and teach Bible Studies. I was
>Methodist til age 12, Presbyterian until 20, Grace Brethren for a decade,
>various non-denomination Christian churches, currently I have been
Christian
>Reformed for a number of years. Physical death was never expounded to me as
>being a consequence of sin. Spiritual death was. Not experiencing the
>resurrections was given as the ultimate death as the consequence of
>unforgiven sin. Forgiveness is readily available through the blood of Jesus
>Christ.
>
>(I read a great deal. I am not unaware of the physical death philosophy by
>any means. However, in years of Christian instruction, I was never, ever
>taught it. Always, I was taught that the wages of sin is spiritual death,
>manifested as separation from God.)
First, a word of warning. At a certain point it
won't be worth my time to repeat myself. If people
want to illogically remain Christians (and keep all
the negative stuff that goes with that) well, it's a
free country.
Of course your churches don't talk about the physical
death angle (ha, ha). I seriously doubt that you are
aware of just how much your churches don't tell you.
That's part of the business, Debbie.
There are no atheist churches, Debbie. Atheism is
not a business. But information can be obtained from
the internet. I expect that will take Christianity
down for good. Who knows how long it will take.
Some people cherish their superstitions, and there is
still (by my perception) some social acceptance in
being a Christian. The truth about Christianity isn't
known to everyone. In Europe, though, Christianity is
basically finished. We Americans are pretty ignorant
about science matters. This list is a good thing in that
area.
Anyway, look at Gen 3:19. The mythology is that the
cause of physical human death is sin.
Jim
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