Re: Evolution & Identity of the ID designer

From: Walter Hicks (wallyshoes@mindspring.com)
Date: Tue Dec 03 2002 - 06:22:54 EST

  • Next message: RFaussette@aol.com: "Re: Evolution & Identity of the ID designer"

    Michael,

    The difficulty is that I am discussing evolution with people who have IQs as
    good as anyone on this list and they do not accept evolution. Mostly they
    are OEC people who feel that:

    1.) "Evolution" is an atheistic concept that leaves God out of the physical
    acts of creation because atheists cannot allow for intervention by God.

      and

    2.) It stretches credibility to believe that simple natural processes could
    give rise to what we see, in contrast to what Genesis 1 describes..

    Instead they tend to be OECs who feel that the Bible correctly defines God
    as Intervening at various points and creating life incrementally as outline
    in Genesis 1. If "evolution" is undefined, then nothing you have listed
    below would be true of evolution and not true of OEC. OEC is specific and
    could be falsified in several ways:

    1.) One discovers an unbroken chain in the fossil record for the evolution
    of one species from another.

    2.) An example of evolution takes place in our lifetime, induced in the
    laboratory by nothing other than changing environmental conditions of some
    creature like rats.

    Other possibilities exist.

    In my mind, there should be offered up a comparative example of what would
    refute evolution. But to do so one does need as specific a model as the OECs
    would put forth ------ followed by examples which would refute that concept
    (but not OEC). What you have listed below is completely consistent with OEC.

    Perhaps I am asking too much.

    Walt

    Michael Roberts wrote:

    > Evolution is easily falsifiable.
    > 1.) Find human fossils in the mid-Tertiary or earlier
    > 2.) Find palaeozoic mammals
    > 3) Precambrian vertebrates.
    > 4) A young or a youngish earth i.e less than 100 million - consider what
    > Kelvin nearly did to evolution after 1860
    > 5)0 our DNA more like insects than rats
    >
    > We could go on.
    >
    > Hasn't anyone got the skill to falsify evolution on these points
    >
    > Michael
    >
    > > I have raised this issue before and nobody seems to be willing to
    > > back up the claim
    > > that evolution is a real scientific theory. If is is, then it can be
    > > simply stated
    > > and then have a definite set of conditions under which it can be
    > > falsified. If it
    > > is not a falsifiable theory which can be invalidated somehow, then it
    > > is no more a
    > > scientific theory than ID is!
    > >
    > > In my opinion, the evolutionary THEORY, not the "FACT", (excuse the
    > > capitals) is
    > > just a set of shifting sand that is adamantly supported by scientists
    > > who refuse to
    > > yield any ground at all in their quest for absolute scientific
    > aturalism ---
    > > proven or not. Slapping Band-Aids year after year on Darwin's first
    > > notions hardly
    > > makes for an acceptable theory by most scientific standards in other
    > fields.
    > >
    > > IMO
    > >
    > > Walt
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > ===================================
    > > Walt Hicks <wallyshoes@mindspring.com>
    > >
    > > In any consistent theory, there must
    > > exist true but not provable statements.
    > > (Godel's Theorem)
    > >
    > > You can only find the truth with logic
    > > If you have already found the truth
    > > without it. (G.K. Chesterton)
    > > ===================================
    > >
    > >

    --
    ===================================
    Walt Hicks <wallyshoes@mindspring.com>
    

    In any consistent theory, there must exist true but not provable statements. (Godel's Theorem)

    You can only find the truth with logic If you have already found the truth without it. (G.K. Chesterton) ===================================



    This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.4 : Tue Dec 03 2002 - 12:11:10 EST