>I can tell you that, speaking as an atheist, I believe that what Hitler did
>was wrong and evil, because I believe in humanist morality. That is, I believe
>very strongly in the sanctity (if I can use that word) of human rights and
>human
>happiness. Why? Because I know that I have feelings and emotions, and I can
>logically conclude from observing other humans that they do too. I know
>what it
>feels like to be hurt, and I don't want to inflict that on another person if I
>can in any way avoid it. Furthermore, I don't want to let another person
>inflict
>that one someone.
>
>Why do I need any other reason than that? Why is this such a difficult
>concept?
>Why do we need to base morality on terror ("be good or you'll go to hell!")?
>I have an easier time trusting a person who does the right thing because it's
>right, rather than someone who does it simply because he is afraid of being
>punished
>for not doing it.
>
Jim Bell wrote
>>Having said all that, an evolutionist is not ipso facto a racist. Of course
>>not.
Russell:
>
>Of course you have to throw out that scrap of a concession to keep from
>sounding
>like a complete religious bigot.
>
Jim:
>>But they ought to be aware that their philosophy lends itself to such a
>>conclusion,
Russell:
>
>Clearly not.
>
Jim:
>>and that their moral rejection of racism is based upon capital
>>borrowed from a transcendent system.
>
Russell:
>My moral rejection of racism is based on my own empathy for the feelings of
>others; my own recognition that other humans have feelings just like myself.
>You may call that a "transendent system", but it is still completely
>materialist
>in origin.
Thank you, Russell, for explaining how an atheist can have standards of
morality. We ought to be glad indeed that it is possible to derive fairly
consistent standards of morality without directly relying on the God of the
Bible. Otherwise the world would be a great deal more chaotic than it is.
But a couple of your statements above cry out for comment:
>Why do we need to base morality on terror ("be good or you'll go to hell!")?
>I have an easier time trusting a person who does the right thing because it's
>right, rather than someone who does it simply because he is afraid of being
>punished
>for not doing it.
This amounts to a misunderstanding of Christian teaching. Christianity
teaches that we ought to treat people kindly because God loves them as He
loves each of us. He loves people sufficiently that He died for them. And
a big part of the Good News is forgiveness. I'll not deny that there is an
element of "behave or you'll be punished" in the Old Testament, but the
message of the New Testament is love and forgiveness.
Secondly there's this:
>My moral rejection of racism is based on my own empathy for the feelings of
>others; my own recognition that other humans have feelings just like myself.
>You may call that a "transendent system", but it is still completely
>materialist
>in origin.
I certainly agree. I feel this same empathy. But what do you do with an
individual who refuses to accept your views of morality? I think you're
logically defenseless, because you seem to have no basis for your morality
other than your own self-validated empathy.
Bill Hamilton
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William E. Hamilton, Jr, Ph.D. | Staff Research Engineer
Chassis and Vehicle Systems | General Motors R&D Center | Warren, MI
William_E._Hamilton@notes.gmr.com
810 986 1474 (voice) | 810 986 3003 (FAX) | whamilto@mich.com (home email)