>SJ>But if science is estricted
>>to considering only natural causes, and there is in fact an
>>Intelligent Designer who intervened in nature at strategic points to
>>introduce new information and direction, then to to that extent
>>science will be an incomplete description of reality.
>
>BH>Science _is_ an incomplete description of reality -- at least for
>>those of us who acknowledge that there is a spiritual side of reality.
>
>SJ>There is nothing wrong with science being an incomplete
>>description of reality, providing scientists state that up front and
>>don't then claim that science is a complete description of reality.
>
>BH>Agreed. Perhaps it's time to throw a party. I don't know when
>>Stephen and I have agreed so completely.
>
>I am genuinely puzzled by this, Bill. I thought most of the time we
>"agreed...completely"? Am I now cast as the resident creationist with
>whom all must be seen to disagree? :-)
Oh please, Stephen. I was being a bit facetious. But there was a point to
my remark, and that is that you sometimes give me the impression that you
want science to be a complete description of reality. Science is an
enterprise in which men try to discover things about nature by their own
efforts. But we worship a God whose ways are higher than ours, and Who
takes the initiative in bringing about His own revelation and the salvation
of men. Knowing about God and partaking of the salvation He offers through
Jesus Christ is not and cannot be a human enterprise. So by definition
science cannot be a complete description of reality -- at least if you
agree that there are spiritual aspects of reality.
>
>BH>One small caveat: I don't think Christians should wait for
>>scientists to make the above disclaimer. People like Sagan and
>>Dawkins won't because they don't accept it. Organizations like AAAS
>>and NAS won't, because their members have differing views, and
>>besides it's outside their charter. Christians should make it.
>>That's our job.
>
>Agreed. That's what Phil Johnson, in particular is doing. I have now
>received a quantity of PJ's audio tapes and one video. I can now
>understand much better where Phil is coming from. He is IMHO much
>better at explaining himself in person than he is is writing.
>
I believe he's truly at his best in a debate, because then you see that he
listens carefully to the other position and responds to it.
Bill Hamilton | Chassis & Vehicle Systems
GM R&D Center | Warren, MI 48090-9055
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