At 11:50 PM 5/23/98 -0600, Bill Payne wrote:
>Sat, 23 May 1998 22:06:16 +0800, Stephen Jones wrote (qouting Glenn
>Morton):
>
>> GM>I am not trying to impress atheists. I am trying to prevent the
>> >manufacture of more of them by Christians leaving the fold because they
>> >were not taught observatioanly correct facts.
>
>Hi Glenn,
>
>If I might intrude into your and Steven's exchange, let me ask a
>question. Recently, you and I had a mutually beneficial discussion of
>the implications of the characteristics of the Pittsburg Coal. You
>posted the following description:
>
>To be more specific, I can't and you can't explain the features of the
>Pittsburg coal seam.
[description of the Pittsburg Coal deleted]
>What is your opinion of the origin of the Pittsburg? Allochthonous or
>autochthonous? What would the "observatioanly correct facts" about this
>coal be?
Nice, but unsuccessful attempt to hoist me with my own petard. I don't
know why you are asking this again when I have already answered it. Go
see my reply to you at:
http://www.calvin.edu/archive/asa/199804/0408.html
you wrote:
At 02:52 AM 4/27/98 -0600, Bill Payne wrote:
>Are you admitting that Carboniferous coals
>are allochthonous?
I replied at Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:40:26 -0500 :
>I have already said that I would grant that some are. Not all. And I don't
>think you have proven your case that all are either. Because your model
>should have some coals in the deep ocean basin. There are none.
As I have pubically stated to you on at least 2 earlier occasions, I will
grant that some coals are allochthonous. That does not mean that all coals
are allochthonous. What part of the above do you not understand.
If all coals are allochthonous, and due to veggie mat deposition in a short
period after the onset of the flood, why is it that most of the material in
coals are roots? Consider this there is far too little shoot remains in
coal for your model.
"If a whole tree were preserved as peat, it would result in a shoot/root
biomass of about 4/1. The amount of aerial plant material is critical for
community analyses that may be based solely on that. Shoot/root ratios of
peats are commonly close to 1/1 indicating enormous loss of aerial plant
material, which greatlly reduces the accuracy of reconstructing standing
vegetation from peat deposits preserved in coal balls and may significantly
alter peat-spore relationships since spores are more likely to be
preserved."~Tom L. Phillips, Russel A. Peppers and William A. Dimichele,
"Stratigraphic and Interregional Changes in Pennsylvanian Coal-Swamp
Vegetation: Environmental Inferences," International Journal of Coal
Geology,5(1985):43-109, p. 51
the following are shoot/root ratios from various coals.
Union coal shoot/root ratio is 0.69-1.16 p. 58
Hunterian Museum Kidston coal England shoot root ratio 2.66
Scott 1, England shoot/root ratio 2.69
Scott 2 1.38
Oliver 1.62
p. 58
High splint coal Tennessee shoot/root ratio 0.72
Hamlin Kentucky Shock branch 1.3
Hamlin kentucky lewis Creek 0.87
Upper Path Fork Kentucky, Cranks Creek 0.47
p. 62
Lower Desmoinesian coals shoot/root ratios
Iron post Oklahoma 1.2-1.9
Bevier kansas 1.09-1.77
Fleming Kansas 2.65
Secor Oklahoma 0.98-1.24
Weldon Mine Iowa 1.29
Star Mine Iowa 0.96
Atlas Mine Iowa 1.07
Urbandale coal mine Iowa 1.1
Shuler mine Iowa 0.96
."~Tom L. Phillips, Russel A. Peppers and William A. Dimichele,
"Stratigraphic and Interregional Changes in Pennsylvanian Coal-Swamp
Vegetation: Environmental Inferences," International Journal of Coal
Geology,5(1985):43-109, p.70
Herrin coal 0.98-2.66 p. 77
Springfield coal 0.89-3.61
Summum Illinois 0.96-2.53
."~Tom L. Phillips, Russel A. Peppers and William A. Dimichele,
"Stratigraphic and Interregional Changes in Pennsylvanian Coal-Swamp
Vegetation: Environmental Inferences," International Journal of Coal
Geology,5(1985):43-109, p.77
glenn
Adam, Apes and Anthropology
Foundation, Fall and Flood
& lots of creation/evolution information
http://www.isource.net/~grmorton/dmd.htm