At 08:34 AM 2/22/98, Dario Giraldo wrote:
>There lies the crux. Because in Gen. 1:1 states that all was underwater.
>In v.6-7 describes God separating the waters. In v.9 states that the
>dry land appeared. And again in ch. 6 through 9 describes the planet
>underwater.
>
>So, if I believe that the earth was never underwater (globally) then the
>first chapter of Genesis is wrong along with the ones detailing the flood.
Not if you do what I do with Genesis 1 and place it prior to the origin of
the universe. IT is descibing the planning of the universe. The statements
"and it was so" are remarks by the human writer, billions of years distant
from the planning stage. In that fashion, the earth itself was not created
until God placed the proclamations in effect.
>
>If to These we add your theory on evolution of mankind, one if left to
>ponder:. Who is right and who does one believe Glenn or Scripture. Mind
>you, even Jesus acknowledged the existence of Adam and Eve no some
>primordial apes as the first ones of mankind.
I will answer that quickly. One should believe Scripture rather than Glenn.
But I will also be quick to distinguish Scripture from the interpretation
of Scripture. Who should we believe, Scripture or Dario's interpretation
of scripture, which makes the Scripture be historically and scientifically
false?
The issue between us is NOT should we believe Scripture. We both believe
Scripture. The issue is whose interpretation allows the Scripture to be
true and who's forces the scripture to be false.
>
>The Bible was never intended to be a scientific journal. It does not show
>a detail physical progression of things and history of mankind.
NO but it also should not be interpreted in a way that forces it to be
scientifically false either.
It does
>show man's constant efforts to set themselves as the ultimate source and
>authority for all truth and wisdom. When Scripture says an event
>happened, I believe it although I don't understand all of the variables.
I too believe that when the Scripture says an event happened, it happened
exactly that way. But I must then search for an interpretation which allows
the event to occur in that fashion which does not contradict everything we
see in this world. I would contend that the modern young-earth
interpretation ties the Bible up with a false view of science and a false
view of history, thereby making the infallible word of God sullied by the
fallible and silly theories of men who claim to believe God and disbelieve
EVERYTHING God has placed in this world.
>
>As an example: Can science produce evidence for death humans coming alive
>? A couple of months ago in a church service the worship leader had a
>cardiac arrest. After the paramedics worked on him for 40 minutes they
>declared him dead. No pulse, no breathing, no movement. A little old lady
>asked the church to pray for him and he rose from the dead.
I am thrilled by the miracle you related. But do you try to explain this
miracle? Do you try to say, "God massaged the man's heart"? Do you say,
"God injected the man's heart with certain drugs?" Do you say "God created
the man a new heart?"
No, you accept the miracle because you have no idea how God did it. You
don't try to explain it scientifically. But you and other young-earth
creationists try to explain the flood via science, and a false science at
that. When you do this, you tie the Bible to a false science and make God's
credibility suffer. Either find a way to have the REAL science or go with
the view that the flood was pure miracle, as unexplainable as your friend
rising from the dead. Either believe God and don't worry about the science
details or find a theory which fits the facts of science and also matches a
reasonable intepretation of Scripture.
>So when you speak of truth, what are we talking about here ? Truth
>according to Glenn.
Scientific and observational truth as well as what the Bible says as opposed
to what young-earth creationists claim it says. Nowhere does the bible say
"animals produce animals after their kind." If I am wrong, point me to the
verse that has animals as subject and object limiting their reproductive
capacities thus ruling out evolution. What the Bible actuallys says is Let
the Land (subject) produce vegetation (object) ...after their kind.
>Other people look at the same evidence you have and
>draw different conclusions. You criticize everyone of them, but
>unfortunately most of them aren't in this forum to debate you and defend
>their positions.
I would love to have them here. Invite them. Please get them here. Tell
them that someone needs to fight this awful Goliath named Glenn. In point of
fact they won't come and they won't let me on their lists. They won't come
because they couldn't deal with the scientific facts and don't want this to
be demonstrated for the flock. An example, I got on Walter Brown's e-mail
list. I don''t know if you know who he is, but he claims that overthrust
faults are not possible. When I showed the people on his list exactly how
overthrusting occurred, and many on the list were asking for his feed back,
to counter this heathen that had appeared on his list, instead of countering
with scientific data, Brown shut his list down. It has never re-opened.
I have asked to be allowed onto CRSnet. They refused me. I am willing to
go to their list and debate them but Glen Wolfram refused permission to
allow me on. If you have any pull with them I would love to get on that
list and debate them as you suggest. But it is they who don't want me.
>
>So when you declare Scriptures as wrong because they don't match your
>conclusions, I must say that every human is entitled to his/her opinions.
Opinions that the sky is purple with pink polkadots are not as good as
opinions that the sky is blue. What the young-earther's want is to present
the logical equivalent of "the sky is purple with pink polkadots."
>But this not equate with being correct. One can be sincerely wrong.
I would contend that the young-earth position, the position I once held,
wrote about, defended vigourously is exactly that---sincerely WRONG.
glenn
Adam, Apes, and Anthropology: Finding the Soul of Fossil Man
and
Foundation, Fall and Flood
http://www.isource.net/~grmorton/dmd.htm