BH: > I think many creationists and evolutionists both make the
same error: implicitly believing that if we can explain how some
event occurs, then we have explained God out of the process.>
I am sure you are right in the point you make - but I am not
confident it helps to resolve the problem of origins. It is a
perfectly CONSISTENT position to hold that God has brought an
evolving world into existence, and that processes of evolutionary
change have operated under his sovereign control to bring about
all living things and man. The problem that many of us have is
that this does not conform to God's revelation about what he has
done, nor does it satisfy our scientific judgments as to the
significance of the evidence.
DT: > I would suggest that "Darwinian design" has an appropriate
analogy with artificial selection ...>
BH: > I guess I don't understand what you mean by Darwinian
design.>
I was responding to a comment from Loren which I thought was
related to human engineers using darwinian principles to optimise
their designs. Objects being designed are provided with the
means to adapt to the environment, and the engineers select those
characters which emerge as superior from the testing process.
DT: > The TE position MUST eventually blur the distinction
between creation and providence - but these are not blurred in
the Scriptures.>
BH: > Not necessarily. If by creation the Scriptures mean the
actual fabrication of all the structures which make up nature,
then TE would be blurring creation and providence.
This is how I understand creation.
BH: > However, suppose from God's point of view the creation was
accomplished when He issued the commands. In this scheme God's
creative role would comprise the design of nature and the setting
in motion of the various processes which would carry out his
will. Providence would comprise His oversight of the development
of nature, which would include any kind of interaction God
desires to conduct with nature.>
My problem with this is not a philosophical one, but a
Scriptural one. I cannot reconcile this scenario with the text
of Genesis 1, nor with numerous other references to creation
(such as Hebrews 11:3).
BH: >I would say Phil speaks from a philosophical perspective,
not a scientific one. And what he says in the philosophical
realm is worth listening to.>
I do not wish to differ from this, except to add that Phil
Johnson is making a serious effort to talk the language of
science and many of his points are made more effectively than
related points made by scientists.
BH: > His view of science if applied consistently across the
sciences, would have to challenge a good many other fields
besides evolution in order to be consistent.>
Agreed.
BH: > In his book "Reason in the balance" he identifies the real
culprit in the current cultural warfare between Christianity and
the secular world: naturalism. It's true that the theory of
evolution can be used as an argument for atheism ... >
For years I have heard the view expressed that we must
distinguish between evolutionism (the philosophy of naturalism)
and evolutionary theory (the science). I have grown in the
conviction that the distinction is unwarranted. This is what
Phil Johnson is saying better than anyone else I've come across.
I suppose I have a personal reason for being disillusioned
by this distinction between evolution the science and evolution
the philosophy. In the UK, TE is very strong. The TE community
is not short of leaders in the scientific world. Yet although
these people warn about the dangers of evolutionism, they do it
almost entirely to the Christian community! They have never
grasped the nettle firmly and they have been extraordinarily
quiet in challenging the scientific world about the adoption of
naturalism as a methodological principle. In doing so, the
Christian church in the UK is failing to address fundamental
issues in our culture. Perhaps this experience colours my
thinking . . .
Best wishes,
*** From David J. Tyler, CDT Department, Hollings Faculty,
Manchester Metropolitan University, UK.
Telephone: 0161-247-2636 ***