Re: [asa] Advice for conversing with YECs (miracle timing)

Perhaps you make my point about his integrated view, despite my
oversimplification? :-) JimA

D. F. Siemens, Jr. wrote:
> I think you're overlooking Newton's failure to understand that the orbits
> could be stable, a notion that I think came with Laplace. Newton thought
> that gravity would cause the planets to pull together so that God would
> have to nudge them back into position from time to time. We have recently
> developed a more dynamic view, with planets changing orbit and smaller
> bits even getting kicked out of the system.
> Dave (ASA)
>
> On Wed, 29 Oct 2008 19:30:42 -0700 Jim Armstrong <jarmstro@qwest.net>
> writes:
>
>> I would make the distinction of incorporating God into his theory
>> versus
>> incorporating God into his mathematical formulations of behavior.
>> From
>> what I have read of Newton, he never really separated his
>> discoveries
>> from his theology. Even though he found a way to conceptualize and
>> describe in mathematical terms how gravity behaves, nothing
>> suggests
>> that he disconnected that from his theology. It doesn't seem to be
>> the
>> mindset in that time to even think that the findings of natural
>> philosophy should be separated from the context of theology. Indeed,
>> he
>> seems to have known very well that he was describing behavior, while
>>
>> remaining aware as well that the cause of behavior remained
>> explainable
>> only by divine action or intent (or content!), its specifics still
>> eluding to the investigator. E.g., why do objects attract one
>> another?!
>>
>> Maybe you were just making the simple point that there is no
>> mathematical expression for divine presence, in which case I
>> apologize
>> for running on a bit. But I would maintain that any theory of
>> anything
>> "natural" has an element of incompleteness without consideration of
>>
>> causal agency and intent.
>>
>> JimA
>>
>> Alexanian, Moorad wrote:
>>
>>> One can certainly be inspired by belief in a Supreme Being to make
>>>
>> scientific discoveries. Isaac Newton did science in order to know
>> God. However, when Newton mathematized his ideas of gravitation into
>> a theory, he could certainly not make God part of his theory. I
>> think it is when one wants to explain what and who man is that God
>> must come into the picture. Therefore, any theory of humans will be
>> incomplete without bringing God in.
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Moorad
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>>
>>> From: asa-owner@lists.calvin.edu on behalf of gordon brown
>>> Sent: Wed 10/29/2008 4:32 PM
>>> To: asa@calvin.edu
>>> Subject: RE: [asa] Advice for conversing with YECs (miracle
>>>
>> timing)
>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, 29 Oct 2008, Alexanian, Moorad wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> What scientific questions creation by TE answers that cannot be
>>>>
>> answered
>>
>>>> by ordinary, non-theistic evolutionary theory?
>>>>
>>>> Moorad
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> A similar question can be asked about any science, including
>>>
>> physics.
>>
>>> Does belief in God cause you to make a scientific prediction that
>>>
>> you
>>
>>> wouldn't have made otherwise? (Maybe not, although we are
>>>
>> influenced by
>>
>>> metaphysical presuppositions that we share with all scientists.)
>>>
>>> Belief in God does imply belief in design, but it doesn't
>>>
>> necessarily
>>
>>> imply that you can prove design, although some scientific
>>>
>> discoveries have
>>
>>> moved some people toward that belief.
>>>
>>> Gordon Brown (ASA member)
>>>
>>>
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>>>
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>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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Received on Wed Oct 29 23:43:01 2008