Thanks for the clarification. So sustenance includes "natural laws",
while governance involves some type of "control" by God. Is this it?
> To say that God concurs with lawful natural processes means that
>at least some of the time God does not act to save creatures from
>suffering or death: God doesn't mutate all cancer cells to harmless
>forms or keep hurricanes from forming. Thus God allows evil to happen &
>in some sense concurs with processes which bring evil. This of course
>introduces huge issues of theodicy about which I make only 3 remarks
>here:
> 1) Amos 3:6
> 2) Through Incarnation & cross, God is also the victim of evil.
> 3) Governanace means that God brings his ultimate good out of
> the whole process, even the evil aspects of it.
>2 is the essential & distinctively Christian feature of an adequate
>theodicy.
You summarize several important ideas here, George.
>> Otherwise, it seems that "creatures running naturally wild" (doing
>> whatever they want, according to MIRM, with no TA),.......
>
> This is a false dichotomy. God is the one who has willed the
>laws of physics, including QM, & who _voluntarily_ acts in accord with
>them.
Instead of "voluntarily acts in accord with them" I would say "uses them
to accomplish his purposes" whether this means MIRM/deism or TA.
{Yes, I know MIRM is being disputed; I'll return to this later today
after finishing my afternoon work-duties.}
But my main concern is addressed below.
*****************************************
Biblically, theistic action (clear and definite) is often an essential
part of concurrence. For example, consider Exodus 17:9-and-11:
"Moses said to Joshua, "Pick out some men and fight the Amalekites
tomorrow. I will stand on top of the hill holding the stick that God told
me to carry. ... As long as Moses held up his arms, the Israelites won,
but when he put his arms down, the Amalekites started winning."
This is a good example of "concurrence" [as I see it] that combines our
actions (Joshua in the valley) with prayer (Moses on the hill) that invites
God's actions (to sway the tide of the battle).
I like the way Steve Gregg (in his GNU Growthbooks) describes the
relationships between us/prayer/God:
"God has given mankind charge of this planet, and generally does not
greatly interfere to accomplish his purposes until he is invited through
prayers of earthlings! Praying people, therefore, are people who move the
hand of God to act in his own interest. ... The true function of prayer is
to engage God in the upbuilding of his own kingdom and glory (Mt 6:10). We
also pray for our daily needs (Mt 6:11), but only as the filling of them
better equips us for his service. Prayer releases God's power to his
people for his purposes."
The whole process involves obedient cooperation (on our part) as God
allows us to co-participate in his plans-and-actions, with God supporting
us with TA (as needed) in the whole process of concurrence.
And it seems that divine guidance (as in T/D #3) is an important part of
the process of obedient cooperative concurrence. {Of course, Romans 8:28
points out broader aspects of concurrence. But, as Christians, our role is
to obediently-and-actively cooperate with God.}
Craig R